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TI0 
Posts: 6
(10/5/02 8:58)
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Cool nWo Angle.
I think it'd be cool if they got somebody - anybody - from Smackdown and stuck him in an nWo T-Shirt.
And that's it. If they ask him whether he's in the nWo, he declines to comment. If they ask the existing nWo on RAW, they say nothing.
Just say and do nothing and let the situation create a little paranoia all by itself.
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Hugemon 
Posts: 118
(11/5/02 1:28)
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 nWover, man
Stick a fork in the "new" nWo and you won't see any blood, or even any signs of recent life, because it's apparently DONE. Over, finished, played, gone, OUT.
I had a feeling it would be a total c0ck-up from the start, & I wasn't far from wrong.
The first mis-step was Hogan's "apparent" face-turn. The nWo is next to nothing without a BIG-name star like Hogan leading them. After Hogan left the group, there was no REAL personality left, with the sole exception of Scott Hall, who was just fired for being a drunk.
Let's face it...The 3 remaining members- The Giant, Kevin Nash, & X-Pac, couldn't draw flies at a garbage dump.
So, once again, for about the 7th time now, the nWo's once-bright & shining star has turned into a black hole.
Oh well...at least we can always watch Hogan HULK-UP into his old red & yellow 1980's gimmick.
whee...I feel young again.
That being said, I like your idea, Silk, but I wouldn't have taken anybody from Smackdown...just by putting someone in an nWo-shirt, you'd pretty much establish that they WERE undoubtedly WITH the nWo. I would have played the MYSTERY card, by using a physically-imposing silent masked man, & giving him an nWo T-shirt.
I would've used the guy the WWF "borrowed" from Ohio Valley Wrestling- LEVIATHAN, who is now playing THE DEACON, I think, as a part of DEVON DUDLEY's new preacher gimmick. I used his picture for my last E-Fed character, The DTA WARLORD, whom I played like my old character, DR DOOM, except he had become a FULL face, rather than simply a heel-bashing tweener with delusions of godhood.
Like you said...I'd NEVER let the guy speak...just have him show up in an nWo T-shirt with his face hidden, & kick everybody's asses, like Brock Lesnar has been doing.
| Behold, a pale horse, and the man that sat on him was Death | |
| ...and HELL followed with him. |
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TI0
Posts: 8
(11/5/02 4:48)
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Re: nWo.
Scott Hall was fired? Well, what's the point for the WWF's existence now?
Before the nWo debuted, on WrestlingLARGE I posted a long, long dissertation on why they'd fail in the WWF. Foremost amongst the reasons were:
a) when Hall and Nash debuted in WCW (as "The Outsiders") they were in their prime. But it's been a long, long time since then.
b) the nWo was stamped with an exclamation point by the shock heel-turn of Hogan, which wasn't going to happen this time.
c) the WWF "talent" simply wouldn't let themselves be jobbed, punked, and ambushed to the nWo for the required 6 weeks to get the nWo over. Damn, just look at the way Austin treated Hall within a week of Hall's arrival. He'd captured him, taped him up, and repeatedly humiliated him.
There was more, but those were the three main points which were all realized by the WWF's shoddy writing staff.
The more I thought about it (later), the more I realized that if any nWo angle were to succeed, it'd have to be reincarnated anew. Bringing in the foundation members wasn't going to cut it - particularly when two of them can't wrestle, and the other's in very average shape. (I'll let you work out who's who).
After a lot of thought, the way I would've done it would've been to bring in Scott Steiner and Goldberg, a la the way Hall and Nash appeared on Nitro. Both Steiner and Goldberg are in their prime and would've cut fiercesome figures in the ring, (as long as they weren't jobbed).
They could've hinted at a "mystery partner", and for 8 weeks you could've built incredible paranoia in the WWF. Real paranoia. Who's the third member? Or are they just full of @#%$?
The two prime candidates to front the new nWo would've been either the Rock or Tripe; but the dark horse candidate I would've went for would've been Sean Michaels.
Michaels could've purported that he wanted his Number 1 Spot in the Company back, and this would be the nWo's Ultimate Aim in the WWF - get the Title for Michaels. (I believe Michaels is fully recovered and interested in making a sports-entertainment return to the Company, only held back presently by where he'll stand in the WWF's pecking order).
Still, now, the nWo could be recovered in the WWF, but it's not going to happen with the shoddy writing Team they have at their disposal and their lack of willingness to get them over.
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Hugemon
Posts: 128
(13/5/02 2:12)
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Re: nWo.
Hmmm...*again* with the Goldberg comments!
Something tells me that we need a separate topic for this guy alone! His name seems to be popping up in many of our discussions, & I don't like to repeat myself.
Yeah, Hall was fired for alcoholism. God forbid that he should drink legal alcohol, when the real WWE performers use cocaine that washes out of their systems within a few hours. WTF is Scott's problem, anyway? Get with the times, Scott!
But, looking at what he was doing to his character, I think I can see a small part of the problem. He definitely wasn't acting like the OLD Scott Hall that I came to appreciate so much. But the biggest THIEF in pro wrestling stole one of his best lines.
Scott Hall started the whole BRING IT craze, "Don't sing it- Bring it.", but now he can't use his OWN line, because The C0CK *stole* it!!!
That's what really irritates me about BookerT being shown as constantly copying The C0CK, when that A$$hole has stolen just about everything he has ever said or done, with the few exceptions of "If you smelllllalalala...", which makes me want to vomit, "It doesn't matter what your name is!", which is pretty good, & The People's Embarrassment...errr, I meant ELBOW. Nuff' said.
Needless to say, The C0CK is the #1 LAST wrestler that I'd want in the nWo, with TINberg coming in a close 2nd. Why?
BECAUSE TINBERG NEEDS TO JOB, DAMMIT!!!!! Wrestling was built on the concept of people getting other people over, via the *job*, so to me, Tinberg was an offense to the very things that I stood for.
I got soooo sick of that no-talent newbie getting the always-favorable *nod* by the bookers, just to prolong his impossible & improbable "winning-streak" gimmick.
Which leaves only Scotty Steiner, IMHO. Tripe could work also, but his character to me seems more likely to go it alone, than to be a part of any team.
I could be wrong here, though.
Did I really just say that?
Hogan fits well in the leadership position as a heel, but he's still stuck embarrassing the sport as a face. I will actually cry honest tears when Hogan dies, but they'll most likely be tears of JOY. Getting back to what you posted about Hogans initial shock heel-turn putting the exclamation-point stamp on the nWo forehead, I think that's what the WWE has been leading up to...repeating that act, after they have successfully re-defined Hogan's character as a face with most of the fans.
God forbid that the WWF/WWE do anything new & original.
As for Scotty Steiner, I would actually LOVE to see him as Big Poppa Pump at the head of the new nWo, or otherwise, he'd be a great addition, but I don't know if he'll ever wrestle AGAIN. The last I heard, he was considering suing Time-Warner for his suffering a career-ending injury in the ring.
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TI0
Posts: 12
(13/5/02 11:38)
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Re: Hogan/nWo.
It'd be an exercise in futility to turn Hogan back into a heel, particularly for the sake of the nWo.
I'm getting sick of constant demeanor-changes; I'm sure everybody is. The worst thing with the constant flip-flopping is that people simply don't care. If Hogan can hit the Rock's ambulance with a truck, nobody's going to care about anything they do to try and turn him heel, as they were indifferent to Austin's turn.
If there's going to be a continued push with the nWo, I'd look at promoting the "next generation" of the angle. Again, I suggest that Sean Michaels would be the perfect frontman, (fitness and health pending).
Other "next generationers" I'd consider are Mike Awesome (resurrecting his psycho ECW gimmick), Lance Storm, and Jeff Jarrett. Obviously, they won't bring Jarrett back, though.
Scott Steiner's another, health providing, while Paul Wight's okay if they can resurrect his credibility. The last is an unmasked Kane, which I think could work; as for his supposed scars, as I've said on WrestlingLARGE, simply say he never was (scarred) and only wore the mask to emotionally extort the Undertaker.
Serve the to the audience and they'll feel damn betrayed.
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Hugemon
Posts: 132
(13/5/02 13:27)
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 Re: Hogan/nWo.
I'll say this much : discussing recent & possible future WWE events has been 10 times as interesting to me as anything the WWE has actually done in the last month.
Did you notice Montoya's input in your religion thread, btw?
Hogan is walking confusion to me. I still can't believe how popular the guy still is, because I really disapprove of his red & yellow face character, along with his Hulking-Up wardance, That $HIT looks so retarded to me.
*shakes head*
I suppose that's why I'd prefer him as a heel, but I agree with you on the heel/face back & forth flip-flops getting old part. I simply would never have flipped him BACK into a face again in the first place, but you know the WWF...money talks, & bull$hit rocks!
I'm not so sure about Sean Michaels, considering the way he went out the last time, although he really could make a big comeback. He'd still have collosal drawing power with both male & female fans. His fitness & health would be major concerns, as you pointed out, but what I'd be looking at the most is his mental state. Does he WANT the belt again?
I have to question his motivation.
The other "Next-Gen" stars that you mentioned, Awesome, Storm, & Jarret could be good... I'd certainly prefer to see them being properly utilized, instead of watching the 2 men already on the payroll being totally wasted. Hogan also has backstage heat with Jarret, so no, we won't be seeing him again.
I've already said how much I like Scott Steiner, but I really don't know if it's possible...what you posted concerning him performing at that WWA show sounded promising. How long ago was that?
Paul Wight makes for good "muscle", or backup, but let's face it....he's not the most intelligent guy around, & his mic-work sucks. I can see him being used, but only in a supporting, non-speaking role.
Kane is one big question mark to me. His character really hasn't been defined...just covered up, like the mask that covered his face, until X-Pac took it, I guess. He has rarely spoken. Anything is possible, I'll admit, but I definitely think that unmasking Kane's character, separating him from Deadman Inc, & virtually exposing it/him to the fans in the light of day would take a lot more character development than the WWE's writers could effectively deal with.
But then again.....taking a long hard look at your current average WWE fan, I suppose that they'll buy, beg, or steal anything with two boobs & a catchphrase.
WHAT?!
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TI0
Posts: 13
(14/5/02 3:38)
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Re: Scotty.
Yep, read The Full Monty's response.
The WWA show was only about a month ago, Steiner defeating Australian Nathan "Front Row" Jones for the World Title. Jones is 7 foot tall and all muscle, and Scotty had no problems in utilizing all his signature suplexes and such. (Midajah also looked good
I recall reading a while ago that the WWF weren't interested in signing him until he reached peak fitness, but Steiner looked fine to me. At any rate, a run in the WWF wouldn't require him to actually wrestle!
Similarly with Michaels, quite a while ago I read that he was in perfect health and could come back at any time. His biggest concern, though, was where he'd be slotted in the pecking order, as today he'd be slotted behind Austin, Tripe, and Rock. Significantly, they said he might have trouble doing the job for Tripe, who played his sidekick for so long.
But you know? Screw it! Bring back Scotty Hall and give him all the Titles. Scotty's never had a second chance in his life. He skipped directly from his 1st chance to his 3rd, and 4th, and 5th, and 6th, 7th, 8th, 9th, and 10th. But he's never had a 2nd (chance)!
Awesome's reportedly injured and won't be due back for 4-to-6 weeks (where I'm sure he'll commence jobbing), but I like recently that they've paired Storm with Angle. I really feel for Angle, though. Of the former World Champions at the WWF, he and Jericho are the two who can do it all - wrestle, talk, etc. But they're the two being treated like total crap. Maybe they should me more selfish, like the others.
A mistake the WWF have made with Paul Wight is letting him on the microphone. When you've got somebody that big, you should let his size speak for him and just let him go and totally destroy everything in his path. As soon as they let him talk, they changed him for a fiercesome giant to a cuddly teddy bear.
I could make Kane an incredible champion.
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Hugemon
Posts: 133
(14/5/02 9:21)
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Re: Scotty.
re: your closing statement, I agree %110! You are not only an excellent writer, IMHO, (that H is for HONEST...never humble), you have a rare understanding of the sport, the likes of which I have seen only in successful E-Fed Presidents. Like Hugh Jazz, Rambler, & Rhino, in our past- then Saruth Scarophion, Dave Sinister, & most recently Sean Elborn of NAFW, you are a good judge of what makes for an entertaining storyline, that also contributes to a Fed, & how a character should be developed.
These are the exact areas in which the WWE's expertise is distinctly lacking.
I saw several sites today, claiming that Steiner had faxed a signed contract to WWE, but none of the links panned out...they were all phony attempts to garner more hits for other wrestling websites. ALL of the major sites of today seem to be doing it together, like one big circle-jerk! They post these phony claims that all link their boards to each other.
...Midajah is something that I definitely wouldn't mind seeing again.
Looking thru a few sites today, I'm not so sure that Steiner will be signing yet, because the WWE seems to be in BIG trouble. I read that GOLDBERG already has a verbal contract with the NWA, btw, & he is expected to be fully signed soon.
Looking back to RAW...what a great night! ...we got to see the match for the Undisputed Geritol Championship.
Gimme a freakin' break. When I wanna see 2 broken-down bums fight, I can go to the city park to watch wino's scuffle over the best begging spots.
Then we have the NEW nWo member being announced & facing Austin in a Lumberjack match! Pretty exciting stuff, huh?
In typical WWE form, they announce the new nWo member to be BookerT, & promptly book him to LOSE his *debut* match.
Good thinking, Vince. Booking people to lose is the BEST way to get a guy OVER.
| Behold, a pale horse, and the man that sat on him was Death | |
| ...and HELL followed with him. |
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From Parts Unknown1
Posts: 10
(14/5/02 14:18)
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Re: Scotty.
Being a big Scott Hall fan, I personally hate seeing him gone, and really feel that without him, and considering the treatment of the whole angle, I think the NWO is dead in the water. I also think we may not see Hall again, unless it's with the Jarrett's new organization, same with Sting. As far as the issue at hand, the only guys I can see putting into this "dead" angle, would be Kane, or/and Brock Lesnar, as two guys that can definitely take care of business. With Kane and Lesnar, Nash, Suk-Pak and the Giant would have some real fire power, all managed by Flair. The underlying theme here, and everywhere else, is that Vince's organization is in desperate need of better storylines and better writers, same thing that tended to plague WCW. Why isn't this obvious to them, when it's so glaring to me?
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Hugemon
Posts: 134
(14/5/02 14:41)
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Re: Scotty.
Yo, FPU...
...does Jeff Jarrett's old man own his own Fed now, or something? I read a column by Tom Zenk last night, that said Jarret was wrestling in the NWA, along with Dan Severn, who's their current champion, btw.
Zenk is an absolute riot, too. He was calling Steph-infection, "The 2nd generation with breast augmentation", & said that her getting a boob job was like putting earrings on a PIG.
!!!~ROTF LMAO~!!!
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From Parts Unknown1
Posts: 11
(14/5/02 14:55)
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Re: Scotty.
Heh...good one. Yeah, Jerry Jarrett's NWA org will televise on a PPV basis, at something like 10 bucks per shot per week, their theory being a month's worth of PPV's at the same price as one WW(whatever) PPV. That satement about Steph, like, putting pearls before the swine eh? lmao. I honestly can't stand her, and that voice alone would make me have to tape her mouth shut if I were forced to spend any time at all around her.
You know, in a way, being the old UWF (mid-south), NWA, WCW fan, in a morbid way maybe, I'm tounge in cheek enjoying seeing the WWF/E Whatever going thru these pains it's having. But, on the other hand, it's practically the only game in town, so I'm ambiguous about it at the same time. Last nite's Raw just sucked on every front, even the RVD and Eddie segment seemed to operate on autopilot. Sheesh, can it get any more horrid??...or dare I even ask that?
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Hugemon
Posts: 135
(14/5/02 15:11)
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Re: Scotty.
Whether you ask or not, I think we're going to find out that it sure can.
The part where you mentioned the WWE needing better writers interests me, because one guy at bobbythebrain.com replied to one of my vitriolic ranting posts there, saying the same thing, suggesting to me that, "maybe you have the midas touch."
I actually thought about writing for the WWF...for all of 2 seconds. For one, I honestly couldn't work for Vincent K. McMahon, & for two, I don't like what the current generation of fans seems to gorge themselves on, in typical feeding-frenzy fashion.
Or in other words, I don't want to waste my quality scotch whiskey on common street bums.
Thanks for the info on the NWA belonging to the Jarret's. I didn't realize that before.
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From Parts Unknown1
Posts: 12
(14/5/02 15:25)
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Re: Scotty.
No prob Tarl. You know, I can think of four guys right off the top of my head that could write more creatively than this dribble being put forth by Vince. You, Silk, the Lone Wolf, or Dog of War could be laying down storylines infinitely more intelligent that what's offered up on a weekly basis. Maybe even that Montoya guy....or was that just a drive by posting by him??...lol. To me, the trouble with the way angles are presented nowdaze, is the fact that they are just thrown out there, with very little foresight, and not allowed to develop over time, the way any good story should be presented, and then wrapped up by the next PPV. ppffftttt!!
On another note, I really appreciate this forum you've provided, and it's nice to see some old faces. Makes me feel rather nostalgic.
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Hugemon
Posts: 136
(14/5/02 15:57)
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Re: Scotty.
First things first- thank you for the compliment. That's a pretty good group that you included me in. I'd definitely include Montoya, and also throw in Corporate Dream, who I'm in the process dragging to the Forge, as we speak.
Not sure if Montoya's coming back, although I'd like to think so, & I'll be positive that he will, until a couple weeks go by without any new posts from him.
I just got ahold of Truthsayer, also, and I'm sure that we can expect him to at least stop by & say hello, despite his being busy with some other things.
And I'm glad that you like the new board. After the last incarnation of The Happy Camper, at insidetheweb.com, I really wanted to run my own board again. So many of the other wrestling boards I found were all about insulting people & roleplaying "toughguy", or gimmick posts, and I really just wanted to discuss wrestling the way that we used to...the way we are now.
I hope to gather in a few more of our lost sheep as time goes by, along with some new recruits.
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TI0
Posts: 14
(15/5/02 11:24)
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A question about Tom Zenk...
Thanks for the compliment(s), you two.
It's funny you mention Tom Zenk, because my brother and I were talking about him just yesterday night.
Do you remember when he and Rick Martel were in a Tag-Team called The Can-Am Connection? They were feuding with somebody from Heenan's Stable, (damn, can't remember who), and then Zenk suddenly disappeared and Martel moved onto the Strike Force Tag-Team with Chico {sic} Santana.
Well, what happened to Zenk then? Why did he suddenly disappear?
Also, it's funny that you both remark on how poor RAW was. Due to some Cable assimilation here between the two leading providers, I get to see RAW only hours after it's broadcast. I had a lot of crappy to get through today and hadn't had a chance to come to the Board. Anyway, I was answering an email to Tarl and remarked that RAW had hit a new low; then I come here and see you both lambasting the thing.
I didn't mind Hogan and Flair just from a nostalgic point-of-view. It was better-paced than most of their matches, and Flair looks in better shape than he's been in years. Hogan looks totally out-of-sync with when he's meant to be hulking-up, though.
Couldn't believe what they did to Booker; when Flair mentioned a surprise member of the nWo, I went through all these possibilities - Randy Savage (although he'll get a face-reaction), Scott Hall (his firing a work to add some rebellious credence to the nWo), Shane McMahon, and even Vince.
But Booker? Damn, if they were going have that sort of lumberjack match, they should've handed out T-Shirts to all the wrestlers involved. They're just as much insinuating that all those heels are allied with Flair. And the treatment of Booker was appalling - not just that he did the job, (really, I wouldn't expect any less when somebody faces Austin), but the fact that he disappeared at the end while the beatdown was taking place.
Also, one of the best things about the nWo was the T-Shirt presentation, but they totally ignored it.
Brock Lesnar won't work as an nWo member because the top-line stars will refuse to job to him. Hell, I wonder whether he's winning by forfeit to make him look tough, or because his opposition are refusing to job by pinfall? At least if they're forfeited, people can talk about how tough they were to the last.
I was going to post some other thoughts here, but I thought I'd just make them new threads - you know, that ego thing of mine needs the spotlight.
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