NUHERE?

Spaceman
I looked at your site some more. More specifically the flood issue. Your site makes some wild claims that are totally unrealistic. Here are some more problems with the flood story and Noah. Using wood is simply not strong enough to prevent separation between joints, especially in heavy seas. The longest wooden ships in modern times are about 300 feet and these require reinforcing straps made of iron and leak continually and must be constantly pumped. The ark was supposedly 450 feet. One more thing about wood. Since the entire world was bad how did Noah stop the marauding bands of thieves from stealing the wood? After all why cut it when you could steal it.
How did animals like sloths and penguins get to the ark since they don't travel well on land? How did they survive in a warm climate? Where did Noah get the Eucylptus trees to feed the Koalas? Fortunately some animals like dodos lived on islands.If they didn't they would have been easy prey for other animals.
Could the animals all have lived near the ark? Probably not since organisms have preferred environments and when taken outside of them they die. In fact most extinctions occur because the preferred environment is disturbed.Now for the math part. In Gen7:4-10 Noah had seven days to load the Ark. If only 15764 animals were aboard one animal must have been loaded every 38 seconds without letup. This doesn't count food.According to the Bible, Noah took samples of all animals alive at the time of the Flood. If, as creationists claim, all fossil-bearing strata were deposited by the Flood, then all the animals which became fossils were alive then. Therefore all extinct land animals had representatives aboard the ark.
It is also worth pointing out that the number of extinct species is undoubtedly greater than the number of known extinct species. New genera of dinosaurs have been discovered at a nearly constant rate for more than a century, and there's no indication that the rate of discovery will fall off in the near future.
Let us just ponder the logistics of this endeavor. What did Noah do with the waste products of all these animals. How did he stop the natural urges to hunt. What kind of exercise was available to these animals. Where was the food stored? These are just some of the problems with the flood. For more read the other post on the subject. Your site claims more and more scientist are believing the flood story. I don't think so. If you take my advise and read the other posts I wrote it will explain in detail why there is no evidence of a worldwide flood. The evidence isn't there.
Your site also comments on answering contradictions. I read them and as far as I am concerned they are not contradictions. THESE are contradictions!

Should we kill?
Ex. 20:13 Thou shalt not commit murder.
Ex. 32:27 Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, put every man his sword by his side...and slay every man his brother...companion..neighbor.(See also 1 Sam. 6:19; 15:2,3; Num. 15:36)

Should we tell lies?
Ex. 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.(Prov. 12:22; Rev. 21:

1 Kings 22:23 The Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee. (II Thess. 2:11; Josh. 2:4-6 with James 2:25)

Should we steal?
Ex. 20:15 Thou shalt not steal. (Lev. 19:13)
Ex. 3:22. And ye shall spoil the Egyptians. (Ex. 12:35-36; Luke 19:29-33)

Are we "saved" through works?
Eph. 2:8,9 For by grace are ye saved through faith...not of works. (Rom. 3:20, 28; Gal. 2:16)
James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.(Matt. 19:16-21

Does God change his mind?
Mal. 3:6. For I am the Lord; I change not. Num. 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent. (Ezek. 24:14; James 1:17)
Ex. 32:14. And the Lord repented of the evil which he had thought to do unto his people. (Gen. 6:6; Jonah 3:10; Sam. 2:30-31; II Kings 20:1-6; Num. 16:20-35)

Is God good or evil?
Psa. 145:9. The Lord is good to all. (Deut. 32:4; James 1:13)
Is. 45:7 I make peace and create evil. I the Lord do all these things. (Lam 3:38; Jer. 18:11; Ezek. 20:25)

Was Jesus trustworthy?
John 8:14 Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true.
John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true.

Shall we call people names?
Matt. 5:22 Whosoever shall say Thou fool, shall be in danger of hellfire.
Matt. 23:17 (Jesus said) Ye fools and blind.

Has anyone seen God?
John 1:18 No man hath seen God at anytime. (Ex 33:20; Tim. 6:16; John 6:46; I John 4:12)
Gen. 32:30 For I have seen god face to face. (Ex. 33:11, 23; Is. 6:1; Job 42:5)

When was Jesus crucified?
Mark 15:22 and it was the third hour, and they crucified him.
John 19:14-15 And about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King! But they cried out...crucify him!"

I have many more. Just ask if you are interested. My suggestion to you is go to your site and prove what is being told. These are sites for lazy people who just want someone else to tell them something and they can sit back and relax. What is being told is simply not accurate.

Author	Comment
NUHERE Sergeant Posts: 198 (8/22/02 6:54 pm) Reply	ok Spaceman I looked at your site some more. More specifically the flood issue. Your site makes some wild claims that are totally unrealistic. Here are some more problems with the flood story and Noah. Using wood is simply not strong enough to prevent separation between joints, especially in heavy seas. The longest wooden ships in modern times are about 300 feet and these require reinforcing straps made of iron and leak continually and must be constantly pumped. The ark was supposedly 450 feet. One more thing about wood. Since the entire world was bad how did Noah stop the marauding bands of thieves from stealing the wood? After all why cut it when you could steal it. How did animals like sloths and penguins get to the ark since they don't travel well on land? How did they survive in a warm climate? Where did Noah get the Eucylptus trees to feed the Koalas? Fortunately some animals like dodos lived on islands.If they didn't they would have been easy prey for other animals. Could the animals all have lived near the ark? Probably not since organisms have preferred environments and when taken outside of them they die. In fact most extinctions occur because the preferred environment is disturbed.Now for the math part. In Gen7:4-10 Noah had seven days to load the Ark. If only 15764 animals were aboard one animal must have been loaded every 38 seconds without letup. This doesn't count food.According to the Bible, Noah took samples of all animals alive at the time of the Flood. If, as creationists claim, all fossil-bearing strata were deposited by the Flood, then all the animals which became fossils were alive then. Therefore all extinct land animals had representatives aboard the ark. It is also worth pointing out that the number of extinct species is undoubtedly greater than the number of known extinct species. New genera of dinosaurs have been discovered at a nearly constant rate for more than a century, and there's no indication that the rate of discovery will fall off in the near future. Let us just ponder the logistics of this endeavor. What did Noah do with the waste products of all these animals. How did he stop the natural urges to hunt. What kind of exercise was available to these animals. Where was the food stored? These are just some of the problems with the flood. For more read the other post on the subject. Your site claims more and more scientist are believing the flood story. I don't think so. If you take my advise and read the other posts I wrote it will explain in detail why there is no evidence of a worldwide flood. The evidence isn't there. Your site also comments on answering contradictions. I read them and as far as I am concerned they are not contradictions. THESE are contradictions! Should we kill? Ex. 20:13 Thou shalt not commit murder. Ex. 32:27 Thus saith the Lord God of Israel, put every man his sword by his side...and slay every man his brother...companion..neighbor.(See also 1 Sam. 6:19; 15:2,3; Num. 15:36) Should we tell lies? Ex. 20:16 Thou shalt not bear false witness.(Prov. 12:22; Rev. 21: 1 Kings 22:23 The Lord hath put a lying spirit in the mouth of all these thy prophets, and the Lord hath spoken evil concerning thee. (II Thess. 2:11; Josh. 2:4-6 with James 2:25) Should we steal? Ex. 20:15 Thou shalt not steal. (Lev. 19:13) Ex. 3:22. And ye shall spoil the Egyptians. (Ex. 12:35-36; Luke 19:29-33) Are we "saved" through works? Eph. 2:8,9 For by grace are ye saved through faith...not of works. (Rom. 3:20, 28; Gal. 2:16) James 2:24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.(Matt. 19:16-21 Does God change his mind? Mal. 3:6. For I am the Lord; I change not. Num. 23:19 God is not a man, that he should lie; neither the son of man, that he should repent. (Ezek. 24:14; James 1:17) Ex. 32:14. And the Lord repented of the evil which he had thought to do unto his people. (Gen. 6:6; Jonah 3:10; Sam. 2:30-31; II Kings 20:1-6; Num. 16:20-35) Is God good or evil? Psa. 145:9. The Lord is good to all. (Deut. 32:4; James 1:13) Is. 45:7 I make peace and create evil. I the Lord do all these things. (Lam 3:38; Jer. 18:11; Ezek. 20:25) Was Jesus trustworthy? John 8:14 Though I bear record of myself, yet my record is true. John 5:31 If I bear witness of myself, my witness is not true. Shall we call people names? Matt. 5:22 Whosoever shall say Thou fool, shall be in danger of hellfire. Matt. 23:17 (Jesus said) Ye fools and blind. Has anyone seen God? John 1:18 No man hath seen God at anytime. (Ex 33:20; Tim. 6:16; John 6:46; I John 4:12) Gen. 32:30 For I have seen god face to face. (Ex. 33:11, 23; Is. 6:1; Job 42:5) When was Jesus crucified? Mark 15:22 and it was the third hour, and they crucified him. John 19:14-15 And about the sixth hour: and he saith unto the Jews, Behold your King! But they cried out...crucify him!" I have many more. Just ask if you are interested. My suggestion to you is go to your site and prove what is being told. These are sites for lazy people who just want someone else to tell them something and they can sit back and relax. What is being told is simply not accurate.
Marys27 Posts: 1153 (8/23/02 7:37 am) Reply	Re: ok Nuhere, you will never understand everything. We accept things based on Faith. Even scientists base things on faith. Theories aren't proven by fact, they are things that they can't disprove, mearly guesses. Apparently you've never seen a miracle. I've seen a few personally, and once you do, you cant deny Him.
NUHERE Staff Sergeant Posts: 203 (8/23/02 4:45 pm) Reply	ok Marys27 "Nuhere, you will never understand everything. " Agreed. ." We accept things based on Faith." I know. "Even scientists base things on faith." Disagree. They have theory and set out to prove it. Theists have already settled the matter with" it must be God.' "Theories aren't proven by fact," Theories are proven by repeatable results from testing.This becomes fact. "Apparently you've never seen a miracle" What is your definition of a miracle? Many things happen that may seem strange or that you or I have no understanding of how it happened. This is not a miracle only ignorance of the hows. It is not God. "I've seen a few personally" (miracles) Are these miracles that I would have a problem debunking? Post them and let me have a shot at them.
X Zack X Private Posts: 10 (8/31/02 1:10 am) Reply	Re: ok >>Are these miracles that I would have a problem debunking? Post them and let me have a shot at them. << Key word there "Let me have a shot at them." because you only shot at anything anyone says to you rather than listen and try to see where there coming from, to see where there coming from might be to hard...rather than just shooting them down with differnt reasonings... So says me X Zack X
NUHERE Staff Sergeant Posts: 229 (8/31/02 2:58 pm) Reply	ok 'Key word there "Let me have a shot at them." because you only shot at anything anyone says to you rather than listen and try to see where there coming from, to see where there coming from might be to hard...rather than just shooting them down with differnt reasonings... ' Unfair. Can you show miracles that would be considered miracles witout any normal explanation? If you were riding in a car down a steep hill and the breaks failed, you careened off the cliff and instead of crashing your car came to soft landing with no damage and no one hurt , I might accept this as a miracle. If you consider having something go your way because you prayed for it when it could have gone either way this I don't consider a miracle. A miracle is something that breaks the laws of science and known reasoning. Even if it is not known reasoning that still does not mean it is a miracle. It could still be something we don't understand.
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 13 (9/1/02 12:12 am) Reply	Re: ok 'Unfair' but true that's what you've been doing <<Can you show miracles that would be considered miracles witout any normal explanation? If you were riding in a car down a steep hill and the breaks failed, you careened off the cliff and instead of crashing your car came to soft landing with no damage and no one hurt , I might accept this as a miracle.>> Might as in you could go either way right? what may not be a miracle in your eyes doesn't mean if you they weren't a miracle none the less <<If you consider having something go your way because you prayed for it when it could have gone either way this I don't consider a miracle.>> Maybe but if you ever prayed about something that was heavy on your heart, and maybe it doesn't go your way but later in life you see it as a miracle because it all came out in the end for the better <<A miracle is something that breaks the laws of science and known reasoning.>> but don't the laws of science kind of fall through as it don't hold to much up? they always are changing? I'm not sure but anyways- miracles can be defined differnt by differnt people so to you what's a mircale maybe be a tottally differnt meaning from someone else (and i'm sure you realize this other wise you wouldn't state what you think is a miracle right?) >>Even if it is not known reasoning that still does not mean it is a miracle. It could still be something we don't understand.<< That maybe true I was talking to a Christian friend about a subject simillair topic and we differed but let me say this To you it may not be a miracle but to someone else that could be the miracle that they were waiting for (sorry if i wasn't alittle reppitive, because if i have it's mainly i am tired sleepish so yeah) So says me X Zack X
NUHERE Staff Sergeant Posts: 247 (9/1/02 6:20 am) Reply	ok <<Can you show miracles that would be considered miracles witout any normal explanation? If you were riding in a car down a steep hill and the breaks failed, you careened off the cliff and instead of crashing your car came to soft landing with no damage and no one hurt , I might accept this as a miracle.>>"nuhere" "Might as in you could go either way right?" I think once that car is falling through the air I don't know of anyone that would bet that the car and passengers are going to walk away without damage. Here the laws of nature are not going to be broken. The car being made of sheet metal is going to bend and break and the occupants made of flesh and bone are going to get bruised at least. A miracle would be for none of this to occur. So yes "might" could go either. If the example cited above actually happened I would consider to accept it as a miracle. "Maybe but if you ever prayed about something that was heavy on your heart, and maybe it doesn't go your way but later in life you see it as a miracle because it all came out in the end for the better." Consider yourself fortunate in this case. It's just a throw of the dice. Let me play devils advocate on this. If your example occured and I know it happens what if you knew all the events that had transpired for this to occur and in some of the events negative things had to happen to other people? What if you getting your request meant that other people had been harmed (maybe other Christians) or impaired? Would you still call it a miracle if perhaps a doctor had died and opened a postition for a new doctor that was better for your situation. Would you still call it a miracle if the doctor that died was caring for special people that he had a knack to treat and now these people would be impaired. I hope I explained the problems with the idea of God intervening on mans behalf. A miracle is something that breaks the laws of science and known reasoning.>> "but don't the laws of science kind of fall through as it don't hold to much up? they always are changing" The laws of physics don't change. Science may come up with new discoveries but that doesn't change the laws of the universe. Light will always be 186000 miles per second, gravity will always work, chemicals will always react the same way under the same conditions all the time. "To you it may not be a miracle but to someone else that could be the miracle that they were waiting for" Agreed but is it true?
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 15 (9/2/02 2:42 pm) Reply	Re: ok Well Nuhere looks like you have a bit of a fan club(4 differnt messages with your name as the topic or thread shall i say?) Well anywho I just maybe something bad for a better good to happen Like the doctor dieing well first how did the doctor die? Nautural Causes? Murder? Other? hmmmm my train off thoughts are off once again I'm a bit sleep deprived yet I can't use that as a crutch when I can't keep focus on my thoughts huh?, now I'm talking to my self...ohh joy.... So says me X Zack X
NUHERE Gunnery Sergeant Posts: 288 (9/6/02 8:44 pm) Reply	ok zack "Well Nuhere looks like you have a bit of a fan club(4 differnt messages with your name as the topic or thread" Isn't it wonderfull?!!
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 16 (9/10/02 9:30 pm) Reply	Re: NUHERE? Hey how are you? Good I hope Yeah well anywho just saying hi since havn't talked to you in a while -Zack So says me X ZackX Aim:ZaWerKae
NUHERE First Sergeant Posts: 327 (9/11/02 4:26 pm) Reply	nuhere Zack I'm fine , thank you for asking and I hope all is well with you.
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 17 (9/11/02 9:14 pm) Reply	Re: nuhere All is well I had to do a lesson for my youth group I had three weeks to prepare but I didn't work on it till today... but other than that all is well with me So says me X ZackX Aim:ZaWerKae
NUHERE First Sergeant Posts: 344 (9/12/02 6:18 pm) Reply	nuhere Zack Hey Zack, tell me about your youth group and how old you are. What kind of lesson were you working on?
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 19 (9/12/02 6:39 pm) Reply	Re: nuhere It's High School age and I did it on September 11th and how it united America for those brief moments of Disbelief, Shock, loss of security and such and i talked about how all divisions were lost and how when Christ Died that should have united us and all the divisions should have droped Edit: I'm 16 So says me X ZackX Aim:ZaWerKae Edited by: X Zack X at: 9/12/02 6:40:13 pm
NUHERE Master Sergeant Posts: 351 (9/13/02 4:07 pm) Reply	nuhere Zack "I did it on September 11th and how it united America for those brief moments of Disbelief, Shock, loss of security and such and i talked about how all divisions were lost and how when Christ Died that should have united us and all the divisions should have droped" (Referring to the lesson in the youth group) I will assume that you have been following the fracas on this board. Are you sure you want to join in? If you have gotten this far I will assume that you want to. I will respond to your lesson this way: you stated that "when Chist died that should have united us and all the divisions should have dropped" To complete the lesson you should look for reasons as to why this didn't happen.
X Zack X Private First Class Posts: 20 (9/14/02 5:38 pm) Reply	Re: nuhere Hey thanks Though I wish I talked to you before the lesson next time I have a lesson or sermen to do I'll run it by you So says me X ZackX Aim:ZaWerKae
NUHERE Master Sergeant Posts: 368 (9/14/02 7:41 pm) Reply	nuhere Zack "Though I wish I talked to you before the lesson next time I have a lesson or sermen to do I'll run it by you" Feel free to ask advice anytime. Thank you for the consideration.
DeadPan Private Posts: 2 (12/13/02 2:58 am) Reply	christs death christs sacrifice was meant to atone for sins, not unite mankind
Unfallen Angel Corporal Posts: 102 (12/13/02 6:43 pm) Reply	Re: christs death Yes, that's true.
X Zack X Lance Corporal Posts: 53 (2/18/03 11:10 pm) Reply	Re: christs death Yes But I think your missing my point, The point that I was trying to make was. We have to put aside our differences and look at the things we have in common. Because we are many parts, but all one body. Jesus died for us all not just: Catholics, Church of Christ, Baptist, Nazzerene, so on so forth, he died for us all is the point I was trying to make.

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