profiles?
Enkis mail actually made me aware of the fact that on this site theres something missing....
profiles...
Lishtar why dont you make profiles of the members with icq numbers, pics, fields of interest, IRC channels and so on?
It is a great idea and ... it has not been done as yet because... oh well, I have to respect everyoneīs privacy too... Letīs face it, it was a bold move to ask you all to introduce yourselves... I encourage you all to email each other ... but I guess perhaps for privacy and safety reasons, we may do the profiles you talked about not in the board... for the time being. Or maybe not. What do you all think?
Unless you all find it is allright to post personal details here!!!!
You know, Gateways2Bab is intended to be a most democratic board despite the bossy undemocratic requirement for you to introduce yourselves Your wishes are my command, so tell us what you desire.
I will start anyway with some personal data for the profiles.
Lishtar loves Mythology, Alchemy, Jungian Psychology and Mesopotamian Mythology in special. My pet work in the last few years has been the feminine and masculine in balance taking Mesopotamia and Jungian archetypes as background for further studies. Other interests are the metahphysics, the Mesopotamian Underworld, the cultic calendar which I hope we explore in depth next year as a group, in other words, I love to research and learn more all about Mesopotamia, exploring ancient and modern text and scholarship direct from clay tablets and latest scholarship. I donīt have an IRC channel, but am on ICQ. Number will be sent to you using our email board members only tool. Lish always plays safe ... I had already received hate mails to exercise loooooooots of caution. Letīs face it, serial killers also come in small numbers and cause most damange... although 3 hate mails in BaBras and 3 hate mails in Gateways out of 122,000+ hits and 72,000+ hitsPicture is not a bad statistics. There is a pic of myself if you look carefully in the home page and click on the Li-Dingir-Ishtar link... which almost no one ever sees... Gods be blessed! I guess I wrote abut all this in the Profile section of our Ezboard. Click on Lishtar link here and you will see.
oooh, almost late already for work!
love to you all,
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
serial killers are not that common in Austria....and ignore lists are great tools for the net...so I dont really see a problem for me to post these informations.
hm.....dont know....maybe ICQ numbers are enough information or email...
Re: profiles?
Have just visited your RuneQuest Mesopotamia site! Will return soon to the Dutch version and explore more... when I get back home!
Ainīt we great???
Would love to hear from you about The Warrior as you understand and experience him/her. Indeed, everyone in the board who loves Warriors. I am quite a warrioress myself, but am looking for fresher ideas on this Archetype for the Faces of Inanna.
really flying to momīs now,
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
Re: profiles?
Sorry - had to dash...back now.
Interests: alchemy, spirituality, the ancient history and prehistory of this world.
The world is OLD and FULL of mystery. I am sure that there have been many many civilisations before our brief five thousand years of recorded history. I find it very hard to believe that the FIRST farmers were in Mesopotamia in about 8000 BCE...
Have researched on this topic for many years, been down the Atlantis, Mu etc paths. Found them not too exciting and peopled with many sillies...hope I'm not offending anyone! Blavatsky tends to be an offput. I hate Victorians!
Nom de plume because I work online and am known to some.
Other interests - Internet - the best step forward in our evolution since the invention of day nurseries!
Computers - the next best step....
People - I am a people-watcher. I'm only now, later in life, learning how to behave around them to get what I want, up to recently have been very much on the edges.
Work - I love my work.
Family - natch!
Mesopotamia interests me specially because I'm curious about what I call the "changeover". I still hold to Bachofen's view that there was a matriarchy, or at least a different kind of society to what we have had more recently, before about 3-4000 BCE. May or may not have to do with Judaeo-Christian influences. I look for cusps of change in history, and believe there is one in the battles between Ishtar/Inanna and Marduk. Suddenly and from then on, the one in charge of the city was not a Goddess but a King. J-C history also refers to Kingship as an idea coming out of Mesopotamia.
Would be very interested to discuss this with anyone.
I think I've gone on long enough for you to see what kind of fruitbat I am!
Dzah Enkidu.
Re: profiles?
With regard to profiles (maybe I should say "proFILES), I have, up until now, used the pseudonym Makarananda on this message board. "Makarananda" is a Sanskrit name that could be loosely translated as "dragon bliss" -- the Makara is the crocodile-like sea monster ridden by Lord Vishnu, the Preserver, consort of Lady Lakshmi in the Hindu/Tantric pantheon. (In Chinese/Tibetan astrology, I was born in the year of the Dragon.) In the Mesopotamian paradigm, I refer to myself (somewhat egotistically and pretentiously) as Urmah-Zu, which means "Wise Lion" in Sumerian. (In Western astrology -- which was borrowed from the Mesopotamians -- I was born under the sun sign of Leo.) So much for pseudonyms.
So, who am I? I was an ordained minister in a Charismatic Christian denomination, and worked as an assistant pastor in a mission church for several years. I studied theology and church administration at Rhema College in the US. But that was a long time ago. I am now a Neo-Pagan, and a practicing magickian (misspelling deliberate). My triple paths are medieval (pre-Golden Dawn, and pre-Crowley) Ceremonial magick, Indo-Tibetan Neo-Tantrism, and Mesopotamian magick and religion. I have found that the currents of Tantra and ancient Mesopotamia run somewhat parallel with each other, and perhaps had similar origins. I am a Reiki master initiated with both the standard Usui and the Tibetan attunements. Reki is a pranic healing system that is essentially Tantric in origin, as rediscovered by Master Usui. I have studied and practiced Zulu magick under the instruction of Thomas (Tommy) Muller, of the Orange Free State, Republic of South Africa. Tommy is one of only a handful of Caucasians to be trained and initiated as a Zulu sangoma. My eclectic approach to magick also includes elements of Chaos magick, Wicca, Norse Rune magick, New Age influences,various types of sex magick, and a kind of "Chivalric Tantrism" practiced by the Troubadors of the Middle Ages. I practice different forms of divination, including the Tarot, the I Ching, and I am currently experimenting with the ancient Mesopotamian art of divination by means of incense smoke. To more firmly connect with the culture and world view of medieval man (and Ceremonial magick), I studied medieval literature, arts and sciences, including medieval and Renaissance martial arts in the Society for Creative Anachronism. I learned jousting in the Freelancers Jousting Company, and jousted for over three years on the Renaissance Fair circuit in America. The Freelancers is one of only three jousting companies in the world to do an authentic, full-contact joust with solid state lances and historically correct Reaissance plate armor. In 1993 I participated in the first authentic jousting tournament ever held on North American soil, at the first Memorial Day Tournament, at Scarborough Fair in Texas, where I was knighted by the King and Queen of Scarborough Fair, and inducted into the Knights of the Royal Order of Scarborough. It was on the Ren Fair circuit that I first realized that I was called to serve the Goddess Inanna/Ishtar -- that She was my personal Goddess. She first revealed herself to me as the the Lady of Victory, the Lady of Battles, and the Mistress of the Chariot. Who better than the Goddess of equestrian warfare!? Later, She guided me into my current vocation, revealing to me that the pen really is mightier than the sword.
My "real name" is John Wisdom Gonce, III. I am the co-author of the book THE NECRONOMICON FILES: THE TRUTH BEHIND THE LEGEND, which was first published by NightShade press in 1998, and is being republished in a revised and expanded edition by Red Wheel/Weiser this coming year -- not later than autumn of 2002. The book is a deconstruction of the Necronomicon hoax, and explains at great length why you cannot use the Simon Necronomicon effectively to practice Mesopotamian magick and religion. I do this by comparing and contrasting real Mesopotamian magickal practices and rituals to the rituals and practices outlined in the Simon book. If you are a true believer in the Simon Necronomicon, those last few words probably deeply offended you. Oh well! If you want to kill me at this point, all I can say is "step to the back of the line!" Necronerds from all over the world -- from Finland to Omaha, Nebraska -- have already put a price on my head. I'm still standing, so what does that tell you?
I am currently working on a grimoire (spellbook) of authentic Mesopotamian magick from historical sources, as opposed to the nonsense found in the Necronomicon. I am also working on a book of Tantric magick, from a Neo-Tantric rather than traditionalist standpoint.
ISHTAR LAMASSU UMANISHU! (Ishtar is the Guardian Angel of Her Warriors!)
Re: profiles?
Ainīt we all awed by John??? I am, for starters... Ainīt we all absolutely thrilled a) he is sooooo qualified b) talented and c) with us?????
*kiss blown to cyberspace to the gods in thanksgiving
I never thought our board would attract so many talented people... and am absolutely awed and grateful to all of you!
I am soooooooo delighted you came out!
In full Glory.
As I knew you would!!!!!!!
Thanks for trusting our board all this time.
And you have been welcomed for long in our hearts and in our circle. We are just acknowledging all that you achieved, celebrating the Necronomicon Files and celebrating YOU!!!
cyberhug and happy bow to a brilliant Soul Brother!
I mean it.
so proud of you,
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
Re: profiles?
Phil Hine, the best Chaos Magickian I know and a psychologist by craft, made an excellent review of Johnīs work on the Necronomicon in his website. I was thrilled to have found it... Sorry for not remembering the URL now, but at this hour of the night I am pretty brainless. Go to Philīs website and visit the book reviews section. It is there and it is OUR companion in the board!!!
Ainīt we great???
Love, light and laughter,
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
profiles
Well my user name of Qulum should say a thing or two. It means silence. For a brief view of me and so on there is my webpage at.. www.angelfire.com/fl4/drmetropolis/index.html
hope that link works
I am a student of the golden dawn, that has been and most likely will always be my primary focus. However mesopotamian thought fits quite well with Qabalah. My main area of study is Alchemy. Slowly starting my laboratory. My email is (naturally) Qulum@earthlink.net
I will add that although i am an HP Lovecraft fan (everyone dies or goes insane. lotsa fun ) and thought the necronomicon was well done as far as a lovecraftian work of fiction it has no place in any serious study of mesopotamia. Lovecraft himself prefered to use egyptian based myths, don't recall him using Babylonian based stories.
i suppose that i may add a little more later.
Re: profiles?
You must be certain to let us know how to get a hold of your book when it is re-published, I'm sure we'd all love to have a copy!
And if we bought them from you...maybe even an autographed copy? Please?
I feel our best defense against "necronerds" (LOL! I love that term!) is education. Unfortunately this means I shall probably have to buy a copy of the Necronomicon.
I've never read the thing, as I thought it was a creation of people who were somehow connected to HP Lovecraft...students of his or something.
Also I'm a role-player and the RPG Call of Cthulu, while fun, makes me even less likely to dig too deeply into the Necronomicon.
It seemed like a laughable idea.
But I guess I should read it.
Sigh!
You know, it would be really wonderful if you could perhaps send the relevant de-bunking to all of us in the list, perhaps a small essay for us to read!
Maybe it could be done in our private list so you can avoid the super spam from Necronerds!
At any rate, Welcome!
Lishtar is fabulous, indeed a fierce protector of at least me!
Love and light,
Kirizal
(Which I believe translates roughly in Sumerian as "heart of joy", which is what the Gods have meant for me!)
Re: profiles?
hmm... the mistake is mine, but I guess John can clarify the issue. The earlier version of Johnīs book that was released when Phil Hine did the review of was a much smaller manuscript of the original which is going to be released soon by top US publishers soon. Thus, we will have a brand new book and by one of our own Gateways2Bab board members in 2002!!!!
I am counting on my signed copy too, Kiri.
love light and laughter,
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
Re: profiles
Right you are Qulum, Lovecraft had no interest in Mesopotamia at all. But he wasn't interested in ancient Egypt (The Egyptians themselves called it "Khem" -- from which our word "chemistry" is derived, but you're an alchemist, so you knew that) much either. Of all ancient civilizations, Lovecraft was only really interested in Imperial Rome, and , to a slightly lesser degree, in Classical Greece. But Lovecraft might have been inspired by a mythical spellbook from ancient Egyptian (Khemite) folklore called the Scroll of Thoth. There is an ancient Egyptian folktale that dates from the Nineteenth Dynasty called "Setna and the Magick Book", which tells of the adventures of a legendary sorcerer called Setna (a kind of ancient Egyptian version of Faust), who steals the Scroll of Thoth from a tomb in the Necropolis at Memphis. Setna endures a series of disasters until he is forced to return the book to the God Tehuti (or Thoth), its rightful owner. Lovecraft probably found out about this legend from two sources -- one was Lewis Spence's Encyclopedia of the Occult, the other was a Sax Rohmer novel called Brood of the Wtch Queen. Anyway, I deal with all this stuff in more detail in my book, The Necronomicon Files.
Will be happy to let everybody know how to get copies of my book when it is ready to go on the shelves. I will also be happy to autograph copies at no extra charge. You are right on the cutting edge when you observe that the best defense against the Necronerds (TM) (I'm glad that you enjoyed this term that I coined myself) is 'education', and educating the Pagan public about this issue is what THE NECRONOMICON FILES is all about. Or at least largely about.
Our book is also about vindicating Howard Phillips Lovecraft, and clearing his name -- exonerating HPL from guilt by association with the various Necronomicon hoaxes. You said you originally thought that the Necronomicon was written by students of Lovecraft, or by people associated with HPL in some way. Don't feel lonely, a lot of perfectly intelligent people have also gotten this impression. So let me clear this up here and now. Since Lovecraft was a writer, the only "students" he had were young writers whom he advised about the art of writing horror fiction. Lovecraft was a very kindly and generous man, so he often revised the stories written by his friends -- sometimes for mere pennies, and sometimes free of charge. Lovecraft himself was an atheist, with no belief in the paranormal, the occult, or religion of any kind. He was never, as some rumors claim, any kind of adept. So he trained no students in magick -- he couldn't have. None of the Necronomicon forgeries on the bookshelves today were written by Lovecraft, or by anyone associated with him. Lovecraft created the idea of the Necronomicon as a foul book of black magick and forbidden secrets as a literary prop to spice up his horror fiction. Even in his own lifetime, people would read the stories written by HPL and his friends, and wonder if the Necronomicon really existed. They would write to WEIRD TALES, the pulp fiction magazine in which most of Lovecraft's stories appeard, and ask where they could find a copy of the forbidden book. Farnsworth Wright, the editor of the magazine would pass these letters on to Lovecraft, who would dutifully write back to the misguided enquirer explaining that there was no Necronomicon -- he made it up.
So you enjoy the Call of Cthulhu RPG, published by Chaosium?! So do I. In fact, my coauthor, Mr. Daniel Harms, is the author of THE ENCYCLOPEDIA CTHULIANA, also published by Chaosium.
No, you don't have to read the Simon Necronomicon. But as a Mesopotamian Pagan, you should know why it can't be used for Mesopotamian magick and religion, as its writers claim it can. And you should know how to explain this to others who have chosen the Mesopotamian path. This was another of my motivations for writing this book. Its blasphemous treatment of the Goddess Inanna/Ishtar, and its bastardization of Sumero-Babylonian and Assyrian magick is......an abomination. Ishtar has been sharpening this sword of retribution for a long time, so I must be the the right man in the right place at the right time with the right instrument to exact Her justice. Don't miss the fireworks!
As regards writing a short essay deconstructing the Necrohoax, I would be happy to oblige. I think we've made a beginning here, and I hope some of my answers to your post have cleared up some of the mythconceptions about the dreaded nonbook known as Necronomicon. Some of this material is already on my website <members.tripod.com/necronomiconfiles/>, which will soon (hopefully) be back at its old domain of <www.necfiles.com>. In the meantime, I'll try to put something together that is specifically relevent to Mesopotamian practitioners regarding the abuses in the Simon Necronomicon. And I agree that the private list is the place for it.
Yes, Lishtar is indeed a fierce lioness, and a protector of the just. She might be Superwoman in disguise, operating under an alias, so don't send her any green kryptonite in the mail.
Thanks again for your welcome and encouragement, Kirizal. Brightest blessings to you.
Not too bad a mistake. THE NECRONOMICON FILES: THE TRUTH BEHIND THE LEGEND is a not just a reprint, it's a new edition -- well, sort of. However, the new edition of the book, forthcoming from Red Weel/Weiser in 2002, has been so heavily revised and expanded that those who own a copy of the old first edition wouldn't recognize it, if the title weren't the same. The "new and improved" NECRONOMICON FILES features a great deal of new material of all kinds, especially material on ancient Mesopotamian magick from authentic sources, contrasted with the stuff presented in the Simon Necronomicon.
One of the great things about writing a new edition of the FILES was that it enabled me to correct some of the mistakes in the old one.
Thanks for giving me an opportunity to clear up the confusion. And yes, you can get a signed copy.
Re: profiles?
Dearest John, I am overjoyed you clarified all points with such style!!! To the circle: isnīt he absolutely great??? *we are all and agree that THE NECRONOMICON FILES is already a hit!
Blush Blush... I am no SuperWoman Just hardworking, cheerful and mystical.
But you are a true Knight!
I am waiting for my signed copy too. I think I can get a copy from Amazon and give your delivery address. Then you sign it and send it to me... hmmm... Hope the book is very successful, not only in Magick but in terms of sci-fi and Assyriology as well.
And we are so proud to have you here with us!!!
Love, light, laughter and (why not?) a courteous bow from
Lishtar
From the Depths and To the Heights to share in all spheres
profile
Well, my dear friend, Lishtar - here I am - I have been here on your board since almost the beginning - and do read each and every e-mail that comes my way - but am sadly negligent at coming here to read all of these wonderful posts!
When I think of posting - for some reason feel a bit out of place as I am not a true scholar of the Sumerian mysteries - have some working knowledge - much from from friends such as you, Lishtar, and my dearest Esharra! But it is much like most things in my life - a smattering of many things.
I am Bendis - my log in says Blue Roebuck - I am that also - and it is my web site www.blueroebuck.com that allows me an opportunity for creative expression about my Goddess and all of Her Sacred Trees.
I am a priestess of the Goddess - serving Her in many ways - through teaching and training other priestesses. I seem to have gained a reputation as a collector of women - I have decided it is because it is my focus to find ways of experiencing the joy of being in Goddess and thru that joy exploring song, dance, and all the many forms of creative expression. I am currently building community in California - I am one of those notorious Feminist Dianic Witches, and our local community is known as Witches By The Sea - we do most of our ritual outdoors on the beach - or in the mountains - we are very fortunate here in Southern California to have both the environment and climate to do that.
My e-mail address is bendis@prodigy.net - I do have an ICQ account 12142355 but usually use AOL IM and my buddy name there is Bendis9.
Letīs face it, it was a bold move to ask you all to introduce yourselves... I encourage you all to email each other ... but I guess perhaps for privacy and safety reasons, we may do the profiles you talked about not in the board... for the time being. Or maybe not. What do you all think? 
Your wishes are my command, so tell us what you desire. 
as Urmah-Zu, which means "Wise Lion" in Sumerian. (In Western astrology -- which was borrowed from the Mesopotamians -- I was born under the sun sign of Leo.)
So much for pseudonyms. 
I do this by comparing and contrasting real Mesopotamian magickal practices and rituals to the rituals and practices outlined in the Simon book. If you are a true believer in the Simon Necronomicon, those last few words probably deeply offended you. Oh well! If you want to kill me at this point, all I can say is "step to the back of the line!" Necronerds from all over the world -- from Finland to Omaha, Nebraska -- have already put a price on my head. I'm still standing, so what does that tell you? 
I am also working on a book of Tantric magick, from a Neo-Tantric rather than traditionalist standpoint.
I am, for starters... Ainīt we all absolutely thrilled a) he is sooooo qualified b) talented and c) with us?????
) and thought the necronomicon was well done as far as a lovecraftian work of fiction it has no place in any serious study of mesopotamia. Lovecraft himself prefered to use egyptian based myths, don't recall him using Babylonian based stories.
Ishtar has been sharpening this sword of retribution for a long time, so I must be the the right man in the right place at the right time with the right instrument to exact Her justice. Don't miss the fireworks! 
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